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Magnesium, Vitamin D, Omega-3, TSH - importance and testing - Dean and Baggerly - Oct 2019

Click here to listen to hours 1 and/or 2

Overview before radio broadcast, Oct 28, 2019

This weeks radio show is an introduction to GrassrootsHealth, a nutrient research portal for the lay public. We are partnering with this company in order to analyze your supplement intake, your health improvements, and validate them with your blood tests. The tests that Grassrootshealth makes available are in-home, finger-stick, blood smears on specially treated cardboard strips.__
The Blood Analysis Kit that we are endorsing covers Magnesium RBC, Vitamin D, Omega-3 fatty acids, and TSH.

As you’ll hear and come to understand from listening to the archive, we have found a way to work closely with one blood testing lab and use uniquely designed questionnaires that document supplements, symptoms, and results that people are achieving on our protocols. It’s the type of nutrient research that I’ve always wanted to do and that’s never been done before.

Having one lab do all the testing removes the inconsistency of having hundreds of customers using hundreds of difference labs and the variability of their test procedures. Using questionnaires that we design to cover the symptoms, conditions, and reactions that we most often see, makes them specific to our customer base. And doing monthly tracking will give us data on what’s working and how we can improve our customer outcomes even more! We can also offer the testing to regions and countries that don’t offer lab testing. For example, I can’t get a Magnesium RBC test in Maui!

Ginney and I are ALL IN!

Medical research obsessively tests only one-thing-at-a-time, completely ignoring The Commonsense Fact that the body doesn’t work like that. Every biochemical reaction in the body draws upon many different nutrient factors to achieve health. Isolating one nutrient just doesn’t make sense.
Grassrootshealth began with a mission to prove how much vitamin D is necessary and optimum for health. They approached us when they realized the importance of magnesium in vitamin D metabolism and activation.

Magnesium Testing

My concerns with lab testing began when I realized that the Serum Magnesium test was so bogus that it’s kept millions of people from knowing that they have a severe magnesium deficiency. Only 1% of the total body magnesium is found in the serum, so it’s only measuring the amount of magnesium that’s necessary to keep the heart functioning properly. When the levels drop the body will pump magnesium into the blood from storage, which make Serum Magnesium always look good but it’s useless to track real magnesium deficiency. This test has kept allopathic medicine from identifying the 65 misdiagnosed medical conditions that may actually be attributed to magnesium deficiency.

For people who are on medication or who want the validation of testing, I recommend the Magnesium RBC blood test as an alternative, although I would love everyone to have access to the Ionized Magnesium (iMg) test that’s mostly used in research labs. The Magnesium RBC test has its drawbacks, however. Most of the magnesium in a cell is working inside the 1,000-2,000 mitochondria busily making ATP energy molecules. You may be surprised to learn that red blood cells are the only cells in the body that Do Not contain mitochondria – which likely makes the cells’ magnesium content lower than other cells. However, early testing results using the home kit for Magnesium RBC indicates a correlation between the dosage of magnesium and magnesium levels – the higher the dosage the higher the Mg RBC levels. I’m very interested to see the results in our customers who are taking ReMag and the correlation with improvement in their clinical symptoms.

We do know that people taking saturation doses of ReMag do have improvement in their magnesium deficiency symptoms and we will see if there is a correlation with the Magnesium RBC test.

We choose a 6-month timing between the first and second Grassrootshealth tests. That’s because, in the first 3 months, your Magnesium RBC test may not improve or it may even drop as your 1,000 enzyme processes that use magnesium grab all they can to keep your body working more efficiently – thus there is less in the blood and more in the cells. If we had iMg testing, we would find that extra magnesium in your cells.

TSH Testing

Hypothyroidism has become epidemic and often goes hand-in-hand with a condition that I’ve labeled – Total Body Meltdown. Therefore, I think it’s important to follow TSH to help show that taking a multiple mineral formula (ReMyte) can improve thyroid function and thyroid symptoms.

The TSH – Thyroid Stimulating Hormone blood test – provides a measure of the function of the thyroid and specifically the production of thyroid hormones. Some say it’s a more sensitive test for hypothyroidism than measuring T3 and T4. If the thyroid function is weakening and leading to hypothyroidism, the TSH levels will become elevated as the hormone, TSH, “stimulates” the thyroid to produce more hormones. However, if the building blocks for thyroid hormone production are not available, the thyroid will not respond. That’s when doctors, both allopathic and alternative jump in and offer thyroid hormone replacement therapy – synthetic or natural. My focus, instead, is to provide people with the 9 minerals that are building blocks for thyroid hormone production.

Both allopathic medicine and alternative medicine designate specific cut off levels for TSH. Here is how the American Thyroid Association (ATA) says that normal TSH levels should typically fall between 0.4 and 4.0 milliunits per liter (mU/L). Higher levels suggest hypothyroidism, or an underactive thyroid, while lower levels indicate hyperthyroidism, or an overactive thyroid.

Alternative medicine lowers the criteria for the TSH range so they can give natural thyroid hormone replacement therapy earlier. Their range averages from 0.5-2.5 milliunits per liter (mU/L). Neither branch of medicine investigates the 9 minerals necessary for thyroid hormone production. There may be some lip service paid to iodine – but often these doctors prescribe high levels of iodine, which doesn’t address the other 8 minerals.

NOTE: Our Grassrootshealth kit includes Magnesium, Vitamin D, Omega 3 fatty acids, and TSH. If you would like you can add the “PLUS Elements” test, which includes magnesium, zinc, selenium, and copper, along with toxic minerals lead, cadmium, and mercury for an additional cost.

In my own case, I found that taking my own multiple mineral – ReMyte, allowed me to stop my many years of taking 60 mg of Armour thyroid after about 8 weeks. We recommend that people wean off their medications under the supervision of their doctor.

Hyperthyroidism is diagnosed when the TSH is very low and there is a relatively rapid onset of symptoms of an overactive thyroid: irritability, diarrhea, heart palpitations, heat sensitivity, and insomnia. The treatment must be undertaken with a medical doctor and may include medications that suppress thyroid function. In my book, ReSet The Yeast Connection, I recommend further reading on this condition and the alternative treatments available.

Hashimoto’s Thyroiditis complicates the hypothyroid picture. It’s called an autoimmune disease with the body attacking the thyroid. I say the attack comes from the cross reaction of yeast toxins, fluoride, and heavy metals with thyroid hormone receptors. When yeast is treated; fluoride drugs, water, and dental products removed; gluten and dairy avoided; gentle detoxification is initiated; and thyroid minerals given – Hashimoto’s can be resolved. The condition does come with a high TSH as well as thyroid antibodies. Our Grassrootshealth Home Test Kit will test for TSH but if you or your doctor suspect Hashimoto’s and if you want complete thyroid testing, you can ask your doctor for T3 and T4 tests along with thyroid antibodies and repeat the test as you follow the recommendations above and watch your thyroid antibodies decrease and your T3 and T4 increase.

Vitamin D

Over the past decade, I’ve been concerned with people taking too much vitamin D because, in order to metabolize this vitamin into the active form you need more magnesium. Too much vitamin D can deplete magnesium and cause magnesium deficiency symptoms. The amount of magnesium required to process high blood levels of Vitamin D might contribute to more migraines, heart palpitations, AFib, and insomnia when they take vitamin D. I’ve even seen cases of people who are so magnesium depleted that a day in the sun can cause magnesium deficiency symptoms as their sunshine vitamin D is metabolized using up the little extra magnesium they have. Magnesium is so important in vitamin D metabolism that optimum levels of storage vitamin D and magnesium are much more effective in producing active vitamin D than high dose vitamin D. The paper “Magnesium, Vitamin D Status and Mortality” in BMC Medicine displays a detailed flow chart of vitamin D metabolism, which shows that magnesium is required in 8 crucial steps.

Grassrootshealth recommends using the serum 25(OH)D measurement for vitamin D to determine vitamin D adequacy, not the dosage of vitamin D since that amount varies considerably person-to-person. Based on their testing, the Grassrootshealth Scientific Panel recommends a level of 40-60 ng/mL (100-150 nmol/L). I’ve been recommending 40ng/mL. However the results of the project we are doing with Grassrootshealth is to determine if we need to recommend higher levels of vitamin D intake. And perhaps the vitamin D levels may be increased with sufficient magnesium intake and less Vitamin D intake.

The vitamin D blood test measures total 25-Hydroxy vitamin D (vitamin D2 plus vitamin D3) in the blood. This is the storage form of vitamin D, which is then converted by the kidneys to the biologically active form, 1,25-dihydroxycholecalciferol. It’s at the kidney level that magnesium comes into play and when vitamin D deficiency symptoms don’t improve, doctors may give higher and higher doses of vitamin D to try and force conversion without realizing that magnesium may be the deciding factor.

Another concern that made me question high dose vitamin D is the fact that the active form, 1,25 (OH)D is a hormone, not a vitamin. Hormone levels are regulated through a biochemical feedback system. For example, one of the main jobs of vitamin D is to grab calcium from the diet and put it in the bloodstream and then into the bones and teeth. When you have enough calcium, then vitamin D levels should go down because no more calcium is required (at that time) and vitamin D is no longer necessary. But if you regard vitamin D as a vitamin, you might think it’s not good for a vitamin to be low and you should take more of it. In our current state of too much calcium and not enough magnesium in our diet and supplements, perhaps we are supplementing a hormone that the body doesn’t need at such high levels.

There is a segment of the population that swears by moderate to high doses of vitamin D. Research swings from side to side on the issue. Therefore, we decided that with the help of Grassrootshealth, we would find out how much vitamin D and how much ReMag would give our customers the optimum clinical benefits and be measurable on blood testing. The average levels of vitamin D in the population are 20-40ng/mL. I recommend a level of 40ng/mL. High dose vitamin D advocates recommend 40-80ng/mL. I recommend Blue Ice Roya for vitamins A, D3, and K2. The supplement also contains Omega-3 fatty acids. We are very interested to learn the vitamin D levels in customers taking this product.

Omega-3 Fatty Acids

I am not in the habit of recommending fish oil supplements because I feel that they are overly processed – because otherwise they can go rancid. Supplements tend to be either highly processed oils that may contain residues of the chemicals used in processing or underprocessed oils that can go rancid quickly.

I do recommend Blue Ice Royal, which is not commercially processed. The “processing” that it undergoes is through natural fermentation of its cod liver oil and butter oil. The supplement contains omega-3 fatty acids, and vitamins A, D3, and K2. Our ReStructure protein powder also contains 660 mg of omega-3 fatty acids. In my recipes in various books, I recommend tongal tuna and wild salmon (both are low in mercury). We want to know the levels of Omega-3 in our customers who take our products.

The GrassrootslHealth Omega-3 Index blood test measures the amount of omega-3 fatty acids (EPA and DHA) in red blood cell (RBC) membranes and is expressed as a percent of total RBC fatty acids. It is a long-term and stable marker of omega-3 status, and it reflects tissue levels of EPA+DHA.

We’ll be sending out more informational emails about the Grassrootshealth Home Test Kit and how you can participate and fine tune your healing protocol and how we can help support you in this amazing process.

Please join both Carole and me on my LIVE call-in radio talk show to learn about this important research project and why you want to be a part of what we are doing! You will love hearing about the value of a scientific, consumer-driven individualized approach to research and monitoring your own specific results!


Introduction - first hour of transcript

[music]
00:42 Jenny: Welcome, welcome, everyone. Live with Dr. Carolyn Dean here on achieveradio.com or as I am known to say, Live with Dr. Carolyn Dean. Either way you look at it, it's a glorious afternoon/evening for you to be with us. We're so excited for our presentation today and very grateful that you're here, whether you're listening via our live talk radio show. So yes, we talk, you talk. Don't forget that part. Or also whether you're listening to one of our archives, we are happy to have you. My name's Jenny Sanders, also known as Jenny Almighty and I'll be with you for the next two hours, along with Dr. Dean and our very special guest. And before I bring our special guest on, I just wanted to update those of you who are listening for the very first time and our radio audience does grow every week, we're so grateful for our new listeners who are tuning in with us. I just wanna remind you that Dr. Carolyn Dean is in fact a medical doctor, and a very good one, as well as being a naturopath, and a massive advocate for public health. You just really can't get a bigger advocate for public health and for the well-being of the consumer, the masses, the little people out there in the world.
01:52 Jenny: She is constantly translating what she knows about medicine, natural medicine, what she knows about public policy, what she knows about the standard of care into practical application and good information for our listening audience and for consumers all around the world so that they have power over their health. That's the theme of this show, that's what we're always talking about is how to empower you. And today we're gonna take it even one step further. Let me remind you also that Dr. Dean does not give medical advice out over the radio show. That is a big fat no, no, but she will tell you what she would do if she were in your shoes and she's been in your shoes before, so she's gonna be able to give you some really good information, which of course you wanna check with your own healthcare practitioner have revalidate the experience that you're creating with her. So let me just say this, I'm going to say, first of all, today, welcome Dr. Carolyn Dean.
[applause]
02:52 Dr. Carolyn Dean: Hey, Jenny. I'm here, I'm right beside you. Can you feel it?
03:00 Jenny: Excellent.
03:00 DD: Can you feel more?
[overlapping conversation]
[chuckle]
03:02 Jenny: Okay.
03:03 DD: Oh, this is very exciting. So, I'm going to...
03:09 Jenny: No, no way. I didn't say anything about Carole yet. Should I say?
03:14 DD: Yes, yeah, say who our guest's going to be, go.
03:17 Jenny: Okay, very good, go. Okay, so I wanna tell you about our good friend, Carole Baggerly who, I must say, is a kindred spirit. She is home among our people, ladies and gentlemen. Carole is the founding director of GrassrooTSHealth, which is a 501c3 non-profit, non-profit public health promotion organization and she, for many years, has been the leader of the D* Action Project, which is an international project whose mission is to solve the world's vitamin D deficiency epidemic. Oh, my god, do you hear the alliance? Here's Carolyn solving the world's magnesium deficiency epidemic. Carole's over here using research for vitamin D and the two worlds are colliding and a kindred-ness has been born. But Carole is joining us today to talk with us about her newest research project at Grassrootshealth and of course you know already it's the magnesium, vitamin D, omega and TSH research project, which is being sponsored by Dr. Carolyn Dean and RnA ReSet. Okay, now, Carolyn, say your work.
[chuckle]
04:28 DD: Thank you. Yes, Jenny sent out our weekly pre-show blog, and it's also my blog for the week, it'll go up on my drcarolyndean website, but this one you can follow on the drcarolyndean live website and you've probably already gotten the email. And for the listeners who haven't read the blog, I'll just go through the first part of it because it is about, yeah, 2100 words, and I'm calling it an earth-shattering blog as we introduce GrassrooTSHealth, a nutrient research portal for the lay public, that's you, me, and everybody listening. We are partnering with Grassrootshealth in order to analyze your supplement intake, your health improvement and validate them with your blood tests. The tests that Grassrootshealth makes available are in-home finger step blood smears on specially treated cardboard strips. So you will get something in the mail if you sign up with us to do this testing, you'll get a little card and letter and a remailer to mail back your your little blood spots, and we'll talk about that more exactly what you're gonna be doing. And the kit, as Jenny already said, it's gonna cover magnesium RBC, vitamin D, omega 3 fatty acids, and TSH. And I'm saying it's earth shattering because I'm pretty much reversing my stand on blood testing.
06:10 DD: I used to say, "Well, what's the point? There's so many variables, there's so many labs. How do you know?" But it's because we found a way to work closely with one blood testing lab and use uniquely designed questionnaires, designed by us along with Carole that will document your supplement intake, and most of you will be taking our supplements and maybe some other ones as well, it'll document your symptoms and the results on a monthly basis that you're achieving on our protocols. And really, it's the type of nutrient research that I've always wanted to do and that's never been done before. And Carole will talk more about how she got into this incredible work.
07:00 DD: So as I said, having one lab do all the testing removes the inconsistency of having hundreds of customers using hundreds of different labs and the variability of their test procedures using questionnaires that we designed to cover the symptoms, conditions, and reactions that we most often see makes them specific to our customer base. And doing a monthly tracking will give us data on what's working and how we can improve our customer outcomes even more. We can also offer the testing to regions and countries that don't offer lab testing. For example, I can't even get a magnesium RBC test here in Maui. So, as I say, Jenny and I are all in, and you can read the rest of the blog. I'll be probably renewing it. I've noticed a typo already in what I read. So, that'll be on both websites, drcarolyndean, drcarolyndeanlive. And that's it for my intro, we'll go back to Jenny who'll introduce Carole once again and we'll just grab her and get her on the show.
08:17 Jenny: Very good. So again, without any further ado and already so much support for Carole's organization, Grassrootshealth, on our chat line so many of our people commenting and I know we got a lot of positive response back from our email that we sent out earlier today. So we're just absolutely positively thrilled to be able to have Carole on the show this afternoon. Welcome, Carole. Carole?
08:45 Carole Baggerly: Hey, Jenny. I'm sorry there. Yeah, thank you.
08:48 Jenny: You're there! Yay!
08:49 CB; I am here, I am definitely here and I am delighted to be here. It's always a special delight to meet up with another pretty active advocate like Dr. Dean. [chuckle]
09:01 DD: Thank you.
09:03 CB; It's always great.
09:04 DD: Yes, that's... Carole, let me jump in here. Our friend at vitaminDWiki, Henry Lahore, he's already chimed in and is very excited about getting the two Carols together, and on his vitaminDWiki site, he's got 30 pages on magnesium and 240 studies on magnesium and vitamin D, and how they work together. So yeah, we've got a lot of support for what we're doing here. So, where will we start? Jenny, do you wanna take over?
09:45 Jenny: Sure. Well, I just... You know, it's so funny you guys and... You just have to know that Carole and Carolyn are similar in this one way. Well, they're similar in some ways, but this way, for sure, they are committed to taking some serious action. There is no grass growing at either one of these gals' feed, and I think we just jumped in, Carole, and started doing everything so fast to get up to speed with what we wanted to do. I don't know if we ever did go into that kind of background of how you got started with this but can you tell our audience real quick how you got enrolled in the vitamin D project and how it's expanded?

Carole Baggerly introduction

10:22 CB; I would be delighted. It started after I had breast cancer. And I don't think I have to ask the question, but how many of you ladies out there have already had breast cancer? Every time I ask that in an audience, there are a very significant number of women and occasional men, who raise their hand. I had breast cancer in 2005, and I had a very large breast cancer, I had a mastectomy, I had chemo, I had radiation. And throughout this process, I found it violent to my body and totally unacceptable. And the kind of curiosity that happened during that time is I have a son who is a very famous cancer biostatistician, and I called him up once at Andy Anderson, and I said, "Do you know what else can I do?" And he says, "Mom, that's the best we got." Well, this mom being a true mom said, "That ain't good enough." And after the cancer episode, I had already, believe it or not, been retired from a former aerospace company that I ran and for two years, I really did nothing except be at my computer day and night trying to find out what else could we do to prevent this? And I'm really into prevention 'cause I do not believe that we have to have all these diseases that we are currently treated for.
12:00 CB; And on February the 13th, 2007, and I will never forget the date, I went to the doctor for a normal kind of annual physical and I got a check-up and she said, "Carole, you have osteopenia." And I said, "How can I? I work out everyday, I eat right, what's going on?" And she says, "Well, you're probably vitamin D deficient." So she gave me a prescription for vitamin D and sent me home. I went home and I sat back down at my computer to figure out what to do with breast cancer, and all of a sudden I thought, "Let's key in to that search engine." And I was using a lot of published research. "Let's key into that search engine vitamin D and breast cancer," and up came a study by Dr. Cedric Garland right here at the University of California San Diego, where I have the privilege of living, that said you could reduce the incidence of breast cancer by 50% by getting a vitamin D serum level, a blood level up to at least 40 to 50 ng/mL. I looked at that, I read the paper, I didn't believe it. I had tears running down my eyes, if you can imagine.
13:29 CB; And I called up a friend of mine that I know at UCSD. I have a lot of academic friends, and I said, "Is this guy a flake?" And she says, "Oh, Carole, he's not a flake. He's been doing this... Are you ready? For more than 20 years. Twenty years! And he's very discouraged because he doesn't think anybody's listening." And I said, "I'm listening." I didn't know what to do yet, but I'm listening. Then in a very short order, I made the connections of a gentleman by the name of Dr. Tony Norman who's another one of the founding people of the whole vitamin D research up at UC Riverside, and I went up to visit him and he invited me to a seminar that was being held by the National Cancer Institute in early March. Timing was perfect. I went. I listened to two days' worth of researchers, a couple of hundred of them talk about vitamin D and cancer, and I was astonished. There was so much already known. Not all of it was marvelous RCTs or not or whatever and some of it was mice, some of it was test tubes, but regardless, the overall information was very exciting to me. And at the end, the leader of the conference, Dr. John Milner from NCI asked a small panel of researchers, "Where do we go from here?"
15:10 CB; I was so excited. You just cannot believe how my heart was pulsing with what they were gonna decide to do. That was before I knew the research community and the answer was, "We need to do more research."
15:25 Jenny: Well, well.
15:29 CB; So I sat there for a minute. My heart was just palpitating. And finally, I pressed this button that says, "I really wanna speak," and I stood up and I said very few words, I said to this assembled group, "Where is your sense of urgency?" And I sat down. The room was silent and I really thought it was over. It's like if that's the burden then I wasn't sure I could do anything about it. At any rate, the meeting was over and the next thing that happened is what set me in motion. There was a line of close to 50 of those researchers standing waiting to talk to me. They had one question: How can you help us get the word out? They care. They care, but they're not salespeople, they don't have the staff to do things like that. And I said at that point, "I don't know how to help you, but I will and because I don't know what the message is yet."
16:41 CB; And then my husband and I took off in a motor home for six months, drove all over the US and Canada to meet with the key vitamin D researchers and said, "What's the message?" And believe it or not, even at that time, not specifically about cancer but about many conditions, they said, "Get the serum level, the blood level to that between the 40 to 60 ng/mL mark and that's what you need to do." And so that's what we set off to do. And believe it or not, that was in 2007, it's now 12 years later, and we now have 48 very key researchers on our panel and the message has not changed. So, I'm here to share with you what can we do to help it go faster and better and save even more lives.
17:40 DD: Right, right, right. Well, thank you. And what many people who followed my words and writings know that I say that vitamin D has to go along with magnesium in order for it to be properly metabolized and utilized. And one thing I've said over the years is to look for a level of about 40, and you're talking about 40 to 50. Now, we don't know because I'm not a clinic where we don't do tests on people. And in fact, as I said in the blog, I'm concerned about inappropriate testing or testing that isn't standardized. But at any rate, we really don't know the levels of vitamin D in our customers with what we've been recommending. So, with the information you're presenting, we really need to know that. So that's one reason that we're very interested but then continue on, Carolyn, tell us how you decided to get in touch with us.

Magnesium

18:57 CB; It has been very clear over the years and it really doesn't... I'm not a biologist, but I am a scientist. And the analytics are in one sense consistent across many scientists, different things interact, with one another. And we already knew that vitamin D was impacted first of all by calcium by vitamin A. And then we did a project with omega-3s and it was quite clear that they were mutually influential there. And it is quite clear. And I told Dr. Dean, I said, "I knew that magnesium mattered to my body because I had all kinds of leg cramps and pains and took magnesium and I did not have these in one sense, before the higher vitamin D levels." So that interaction was physically apparent to me. And we wanted to look at vitamin D, excuse me, at magnesium because it's so important. Oh, and just to... Not my history but just literally this week, a new study came out of China, showing a 40% reduction with a higher magnesium intake, 40% in the incidence of breast cancer. So, you know, you know that vitamin D and magnesium impact another in this hopeful breast cancer prevention.
20:36 CB; At any rate, we call Dr. Dean and said, "Hey, we wanna do this and we need different compounds of magnesium." because what's interesting about magnesium in the marketplace, which we do not really have with vitamin D much anymore, there's one compound of vitamin D, the D3. And with magnesium Dr. Dean has her magnesium chloride in this pickle like ionic form, and then there's magnesium sulfate, there's all kinds of things out there and they have different impacts because even though all of them might say, "Oh, you're getting 500 milligrams of magnesium." the amount of absorption varies considerably. So we really want to explore what it's like taking the different compounds because you're not gonna get the same answer for every compound.
21:40 DD: Yes, very good. And now with the computerization of all the different factors, it's the perfect timing to get all these algorithms in place and seek out the data. We're doing an absorption study at a university now, but it's not a clinical study, it's not a people study so we wanna hit this from both ends and find out what's really happening. I've always said Carole that just get a clinic and put everybody on certain supplements and do some befores and afters and you'll have answers about what people really require to stay healthy, and that's exactly what you're doing.
22:29 CB; What we're very excited about because one of my main motivations is very, very similar to you is with your power over your own health. Totally agree. One of my personal kind of motivations always is independent choice. I want to be able to decide for myself what's this for me? Well, I can't do it if I don't know the data. And that's really what led me into the testing and the tracking of my health outcomes because I know that in order to really see, is it helping me, does it help me? Is it efficacious? And by the way consumers all over the world now are saying, the biggest thing they wanna know about particular nutrients is what is its efficacy. Is it working for me? And so we designed the system itself, the computer system to allow users to see, is it working for you and the added questions and stuff that Dr. Dean put in are going to enable everybody that participates, a way to track those very easily, and also to see results. So, I'm very excited.
23:53 DD: So let's go to Jenny. Jenny, how are we gonna implement this? Before we go to that and to questions, let's tell folks how they can become involved.
24:05 Jenny: Okay. And let me also just say that the phone number tonight is 6026666027. And if you do wanna talk to Carole or have specific questions about this project, I would love for you to call in, you can use the chat line but talking by phone is also good. And you just have to hit star five on your keypad to let me know you're here and you've got a question, and when it comes to that point, we will definitely put you on a line with Carole and Dr. Dean. Now, the way we're gonna implement it is, we are going to have a landing page on our website. It's not ready quite yet because we're still working on some of the little graphics and things. Of course, Dr. Dean wanted to add the TSH because of the relationship between the thyroid, all the minerals and also because the relationship of thyroid to magnesium. So we're doing a comprehensive program, that landing page is gonna be on our website. We will send you all an email let you know it's up and then you can enroll in the program. And the cost of the program, is I think $214, right Carolyn to get started?
25:18 DD: Yes, that's right.
25:19 Jenny: For all the testing. But what we are doing, people do not panic, is we are giving you believe it or not, the equivalent amount in very good super delicious scrummy discounts for the products during the course of the six-month program. So your cost is going to be even-steven. Is that the coolest thing ever or what? Hold on one minute, hold on wait for it.
[applause]
[laughter]
25:49 Jenny: Yeah. Because we want you to be empowered about doing this. Now you guys already know, even to just do the request to test and all these other things and anybody who's been... I just went to any lab test now a couple weeks ago to do some testing and it was expensive. So this is actually very, very, very, very, very affordable and you're gonna get tracking through the whole process, which is another thing that's really exciting. So you've got Dr. Deans backing. You're gonna get products from ourselves and also from our partners, who are gonna pitch in and do some heavy lifting on this 'cause we really want you to succeed, and you're gonna have, when you get... We'll ship you your kid when you get your kit, it's got all the instructions in it about how to actually complete the test, how to go online, how to register, everything's confidential. Nobody's telling secrets or giving out your information. It's all highly confidential, because it is medical information and you'll be able to go along, complete your trackers and follow your results and monitor your performance. So it's just so exciting what we have going on with this. And then over the course of that period of time, the whole six months that you're in the research project, you are also going to get updates and in those updates, you're also gonna receive information about how to redeem your product vouchers and all kinds of other stuff, so it's super cool and groovy.
27:24 Jenny: And customer support will be able to help you. They've got all kinds of resources and they're gonna know exactly what you're gonna need as we work it out. We'll work with everybody, it's gonna be really, really, really fun. It's gonna be really fun.
27:40 DD: So here's Jenny taking on yet another enormous project.
[laughter]
27:45 DD: On top of everything else, yeah. I mean...
27:53 Jenny: Yeah, but we've got such a great team. We have the best customer support team ever in the whole wide world. It sounds like it's impressive that I'm doing something, but really it's just everybody who already does all the work. They're gonna do a great job, and we are gonna have a great time with this, so more information to come. But we wanted to give you a chance also to talk with Carole and ask any questions that you would have of her and also Dr. Dean about this whole process. So what else do we want to say...
28:27 DD: Well, things...
28:27 Jenny: At this...
28:28 DD: Will come up, but let me just dive in with a couple of mail bags that were emailed to us while Jenny sorts out the chat line Carole. The first question is from Cheryl, and she's asking, "Will this test could be available internationally? I live in Australia. Kindest regards."
28:50 CB; Absolutely. We ship internationally literally all over the world. We have customers, participants and actually lots of them in Australia, Canada, Sri Lanka, China. We have literally worldwide participants. They are shipped with a particular desire, however, for return. Part of the testing is with the omega-3s and those have a time to quickly turn them around after you put your blood on the card. You need to return them immediately. Believe it or not, the vitamin D blood spots have been tested and last quite a while.
[chuckle]
29:35 DD: No, that's wonderful. That's awesome, because we tell people to go to our US-based request a test. And certainly nobody outside of the US can do that, and as Jenny says, you can go to any lab. So there's no standardization with these online blood tests, but with these blood spot tests that you're going to be doing, they all go to one lab and if there's any discrepancy then they'll repeat the test or ask... And send out another kit. We can just cover so many of the inconsistencies that occur in lab testing. So that's...
30:18 CB; I would like to mention one other thing about variation that we didn't know about until we actually did a case study on it just about a year ago. There is variation in people's tests somewhat. But again we use the one lab. But our case study was done with one person and what she did was she took her blood spot test for the vitamin D at several times during the day, during morning, noon and night, over a period of several weeks for several days. And the phenomenal thing was just like, oh my gosh. We didn't know that, and the vitamin D researchers didn't know that yet either, was there was a difference, a higher reading at about noon, 20% higher than there was at the morning or evening. Which really flies in the... The whatever of the labs are different, because the labs aren't different by 20%. So what we would ask all of you to do, is to make sure that whatever time of day you choose to do your vitamin D blood spot test, do it the same the next time and any other time, because it matters. And what it matters with magnesium, I don't know, but we sure no about vitamin D.
31:41 DD: Okay I'm gonna have to update my blog with two things. We ship internationally, and take the test at the same time every day. Excellent.
31:50 CB; You got it. You got it.
31:51 DD: Okay. The next question, this person, Susan, she's happy to learn about the collaboration with Grassrootshealth. She says, "I've been a member and participating in their breast cancer study for a number of years now. I actually wrote to them a year or two ago and I asked, 'What about magnesium?'" It's nice to see that they contacted you. Now she asked a question, Carole, about your heavy metal blood spot test. Now, we're not diving into that test but because people will go to your website and we should mention that, it's Grassrootshealth.net. They'll go the site...
32:36 CB; Correct.
32:37 DD: And they'll see this test and it's for several of the minerals, the magnesium, selenium, copper and... What's the fourth one I'm missing of your minerals? Copper, selenium... magnesium of course. And then you also do... What is it? Mercury, arsenic and lead?
33:04 CB; Right. Yes, yes.
33:05 DD: And we're just... We're grabbing the magnesium out of that test but you can certainly just... As you're signed up as a member on Grassrootshealth, you can order any of these tests. But I think the same applies, Susan's asking, "My question about the heavy metals blood spot test that is offered, how to interpret it, how to relate it to the urine challenge test. I really want to follow my progress." And she's also saying, "What about hair analysis test?" Now, that's a lot of questions and, you know, what we know about a urine challenge test is they'll give you a chelating agent, DMSO, DMSA, something to force the body to release some heavy metals. I don't like those tests because in our very complex total body meltdown patients forcing heavy metals out of storage into the blood stream can actually make you feel worse. So, not to put too much emphasis on the answers because we can't go into great detail but how does the... Our lab blood spot test differ from other testing?
34:27 CB; In general, lack of these?
34:32 DD: Well, this person, I think she gave some history about how she has heavy metals and she's been tested here and there. I would think that doing the blood spot... Doing it in one lab is very important for the follow-up. Comparing... You can't compare apples and oranges.
34:51 CB; Yeah, I agree. Now I think that is very important because if you're gonna do it and if you want to track changes, especially, you wanna make sure you're doing it in the same lab and back again, we strongly recommend same time a day for everything. And the interpretation of the test depends upon which one it is but the lab also provides some information on, you know, "here's what this test is used for, here's what you can track, here's the minimum maximum," and all that so.
35:23 DD: Right. Right right.
35:25 CB; And we will be feeding back to you as well, over time, not the first couple of months, but as time goes on, we will make some charts and everything for you to see what levels people have and what any consequences are that we can determine with their health outcomes as well.
35:46 DD: Mm-hmm. Yes and...
35:48 CB; There is a... It's called an elements panel. There's a...
35:53 DD: Oh yeah.
35:54 CB; Yeah, on our... We call it an elements panel. And actually, I think you have a small set of those for people that want to do that elements set. So they can either order it from you or from us. And...
36:10 DD: Right. Right right. Yes. And Susan's asking, "What about hair analysis?" Well, I'm not... I'm keen on hair analysis only for heavy metals but I think blood is just much more today. Hair analysis is three months ago. So to get your blood for the heavy metals is very important and if it's in the blood, it means something. We should not have heavy metals in our blood. If it's in the hair, what's happening there is the body is releasing it, it's kicking it out, it's getting rid of it. It means it's in your hair, outside, detoxed, it's not in your body, in your blood.
36:55 DD: So to me a blood spot test is superior and it's a matter in our protocols of doing your testing if you want the elements panel and making sure you're on your ReMag, ReMyte and ReAline and the RnA ReSet Drops to help rebuild perfect cells doing the whole protocol and then following it every six months. And then you become... You are in control of your own process rather than going to doctors who... We were not told anything about heavy metal testing or heavy metal treatment in medical school. So you are kind of on your own except for the support that we'll certainly give you. So I think that's a good answer there.
37:52 DD: The next question, now this is just about ReMag. Someone who's been on ReMag, ReMyte, ReAline and was doing well and then their blood testing looks good, RBC, magnesium, and then they started to get some cramping. They're asking would you recommend any particular test that can help me figure out what's out of balance now. What we say to people there, is to get in touch with us, report it on eresa.com and help us know a little more. We don't know how much ReMag and ReMyte you're taking. You may not be taking enough, you may be on medications that will burn off your magnesium. You may not be looking at your calcium intake to help balance the mineral. So there's a little more to that answer that we need more information on.

TSH

38:45 DD: And the fourth question is quickly answered too, before we go to the chat and phone. They're asking about the TSH testing that we talked about that we're doing and Mara says, My understanding is that TSH is a pituitary hormone and not a good measurement of thyroid function. And that's not true. What happens with the TSH testing is, it is a test that shows the pituitary has to push the thyroid to produce more thyroid hormones 'cause there is not enough. And this person said that the T3, T4, are important and of course they are, what we're doing with the TSH is a screening. And if it's according to the numbers that you'll get back on your reference ranges from the lab, you'll know whether you have too much or too little, and then the next steps to take. So it is a screen, we're not been your doctor here in doing your... All your testing, as you'll see in the blog. I've said even with people who may have Hashimoto's thyroiditis, you'll have to get testing for your thyroid antibodies.
40:06 DD: So we're trying to cover all the bases, but we want you to work with us, about this. We're doing screening here, and heading information in your hands, so that you can be more in charge of your health. Okay.
40:24 CB; One of the things if I may Dr. Dean to add, is one of the things that all the participants will get is, again it won't happen in the first month. But ongoing there will be charts and some of that are available right away showing, Where do you fill in terms of your blood level or whatever it is you're measuring, against the total population? And that is really, really very helpful and eye-opening to lots of people, especially, when it's associated with some kind of symptom like pain. And you can see where the people who have reduced pain, where they are with their vitamin D levels, and where those who have more pain are. So you can make independent decisions about what's working for you.
41:14 DD: Yes, very nice, very nice. Jenny what do you have for us with the chat and the... And phones?
41:23 Jenny: Okay, so a couple of different things on the chat. Garrison asked to please explain the test details, exactly what tests, exactly. So I think we're gonna say Garrison that, all that is typed out in the blog. So I am gonna post the link to the blog in the email, so that you can see it and read it, in time and then you can have time to follow up and ask more questions either through the phone or through the chat line here. So let me also ask another question that came in from Lisa. She said, "I read that magnesium sufficiency will result in needing to take less vitamin D to reach whatever level is desired. In other words, just by taking magnesium alone, one's vitamin D level may also rise, is this true?
42:15 DD: I think it's true from what we've observed. I don't know, Carole's got the stats to show that yet. But that's one of the things what... That we're all really excited to be able to learn. Correct, Carole.
42:32 CB; Absolutely. And again, that's one of the reasons why we're also testing the omega-3, because that has an influence as well and there are many things we aren't testing. But we really know that the omegas, vitamin D and magnesium interact with each other a lot. So what the end result of that is, that's what we're all hoping you will help show it.
43:00 DD: Yeah, yeah it's up to us to do the... We're doing the research. Everybody out there is n and n equal to one, and it's very exciting.
43:12 CB; Yes.
43:12 DD: Okay.
43:13 Jenny: We did ask on everyone's behalf if the insurance company, if this is something that you might be able to submit to your insurance company and the answer is unfortunately no, because it's part of a research project. And the tests are covered in an insurance situation, only if they're part of a physician's requirement. But what Carole said was, this is true citizen science and I thought that was so cute, citizen science, because that's exactly what this is. We are all scientists and everybody who's been listening to our radio show for any length of time, or doing our protocol, Carole. Carolyn Dean has made everybody on this radio show, a scientist. Carole, you can't believe what Carolyn does. She puts everybody to N equals one all the time. And so you guys are uniquely qualified to do this. It's gonna be fun.
44:14 Jenny: Okay, next question, Lisa typed in with the follow-up question. And that was since hormones are related to TSH, thyroid and breast cancer, would you consider adding progesterone and estrogen into your test options?
44:34 DD: Well, that's up to Carole. That's getting into becoming your endocrinologist becoming your doctor. And what I've always said about the estrogen, progesterone, testosterone, they really depend on the building blocks to make them...
44:52 CB; Yes.
44:52 DD: Which is the minerals especially magnesium, the B vitamins. And what we hope with these basic nutrients that do so much that by having a good grounding and baseline, they will start bouncing out the end products of the nutrient building blocks which are the hormones. So when you do hormone testing, progesterone, estrogen, testosterone, that just tells you that your end product of hormones just like your thyroid hormones, they're high, low, or in between. And we don't even know what that means for the individual with progesterone and estrogen. And what we're finding when people get enough of the ReMag and ReMyte their sex hormones, their thyroid hormones and their adrenal start balancing out, and their symptoms shift. So, yeah, we're not gonna... I personally am not gonna get into end-stage hormone testing to then be subject to hormone replacement therapy attitudes of doctors.
46:09 DD: I know that's a bit... I'm being a little hoity-toity about that, but I just want to get the basics, the grounding basics first, before pretty much sending people off to fine tune with a good endocrinologist or internist. We're doing the basics here. So there...
46:35 CB; So there.
46:35 Jenny: Okay now.
46:36 CB; So there.
[chuckle]
46:39 Jenny: So there... Now one of the things though, just about the time we say we're doing the basics, did we not also agree to do some kind of thing about an elements test, Carolyn?
46:53 DD: Well, those are the minerals.
46:54 CB; Yes, she just...
46:56 Jenny: Oh, those are all the minerals. Okay, 'cause they...
47:00 DD: Those are the four minerals that we have in our ReMyte so the people who do the elements test on their own, who order it on their own, we have like a dozen of those tests, and you can order them and we'll follow them but that would be amazing to learn if people on the ReMyte are getting those elements, and that elements test has the three toxic metals as well; the lead, mercury and arsenic.
47:30 Jenny: Okay, very good. Alright. So...
47:31 CB; It doesn't have...
47:34 Jenny: Go ahead. You're on.
47:34 CB; It doesn't have arsenic. It has cadmium. The three...
47:38 DD: Oh.
47:38 CB; The selenium, zinc and copper it has and it also has cadmium, lead and mercury. So those are part of the Elements Panel and anybody can order those at any time. We've had seriously some ultra high lead levels on a couple of participants not out of your group, but in our big cohort. By the way, we've got close to 15,000 people enrolled in various projects, so we have a lot of data out there to share with you. Anyway, what happens if the lead level is very high, is an alert actually comes to us from the lab saying that they have to contact the participant to let them know that this... When it reaches a certain level, alright, it's a legal issue. It's not just, "Here's your value." It's like, "Hey, something needs to be done about this." And the done about it turns out to be in many cases something very simple. Like somebody touched something or they got something on their clothes, a particular piece of food. It's not an ongoing problem, but regardless, that gets the attention of the lab.
49:00 CB; The other area of alertness that we have people ask about from time to time is, "Can I get toxic? What happens?" And if I may, I'd like to speak a minute about that because when people take any new substance, they... They wanna know how much. [chuckle] And the relationship of toxicity back again, we use the serum level of the marker, not how much you take, because that varies way too much in terms of the end result. But to be so-called toxic and the toxicity by the way is measured with hypercalcemia, not a vitamin D level. But cases of hypercalcemia occurs when the serum level was above 200 nanograms per ml or 500 nanomoles per liter, for those of you in Canada or other countries.
50:00 CB; It's hard to get there folks, unless you're taking an awful lot or at least 30,000 international units a day for a very long period of time. So if you stick with your focus on the 40 to 60 level or 100 to 150 nanomoles per liter, the only toxicity would be due to something else, so pay attention to that.
50:26 DD: Well, and so yeah, Carole's talking about vitamin D, taking vitamin D. What we find in our complex magnesium deficient patients is they may get sorted out on their magnesium and then they're told to take high levels of vitamin D and then they start to get their magnesium deficiency symptoms again. And it's kind of freaky for them except when they start Googling and find out that the vitamin D makes your body require more magnesium in order to metabolize that vitamin D. And of course, Carole's talking about vitamin D3, correct Carole? Not vitamin D2 which is.
51:11 CB; Yes.
51:13 DD: The straight synthetic Vitamin D. So yeah, it's where we will learn because Carole, you know from our discussions that I'm mainly telling people to get Vitamin D from sunshine, from our Blue Ice Royal and from their diet. So the information we'll get back on this study is whether or not that's giving people enough Vitamin D. And if it's not, we will make adjustments, there's no question that we will use this information to make our recommendations as perfect as possible. And you wanna talk about sunshine a little bit.
51:54 CB; Yes That was one of the really key things way back, and it seems like way back now, but way back in 2007 and '09 and '11, those kind of time periods. Sunshine the way our current public health recommendations are in the United States, and many other places around the world. Well, let me back up one sentence. The reason we have a vitamin D deficiency, pure and simple, is because we had this thing called an industrial revolution where we came inside, that was more than a 100 years ago. And yet it's being out of the sun that has really caused this problem, and in foreign countries that includes wearing clothes that totally cover you up. Alright. And what this then got translated into from various public health people is, "Oh, you need to stay out of the sun and specifically don't go out on the sun between 10:00 and 2:00, because that's when the sun is highest, and we don't want you to get cancer. And there are actually, with outdoor workers, who are outside all the time, there are less cases in cancer than those people who work inside. Fact, right?
53:22 CB; And with sunshine, if you are gonna use sunshine and we wholeheartedly recommend, there's a whole big page on our website about how to use the sun. Main issue, don't burn. It's that simple, get out. But it varies, what you need in the sun varies depending upon your skin type, it depends upon the latitude, it depends on the time of year. But the key time to be out to get what are called the UVB rays from the sun which are what generate the Vitamin D in your body, is between 10:00 and 2:00. There's almost no point in going out for sunshine in an early morning or in the evening. So that does not produce Vitamin D in your body. And then back again to where are the sources of vitamin D? The sources of vitamin D certainly can be sunshine or some kind of artificial light, they can be supplements, they can't... There's very, very little intake from food, unless you're eating whale blubber, and that just isn't one of my favorite foods. There is some in Salmon, Salmon has about 400 international units per serving. The average person, that weighs about 150 pounds is going to need at least four or 5000 international units a day, nobody is going to eat 10 servings of fish a day. Alright.
54:49 CB; So please don't expect enough Vitamin D to be in your food, it's just not there. That's not how the world was put together, it was supposed to be outside with the sun, and certainly to some extent with fatty fish. We will have lots of information coming everybody's way about sources of Vitamin D, how it works, and so read your emails and certainly visit our website to see more about this information. Thank you.
55:21 Jenny: Okay, let's hold right there. We've got a station break, we're gonna go run over into the next hour, so just take a sip of your ReMag water everybody, and we'll be right back, lots of questions and time to chat with Carole.
[music]
55:40 S?: We'll be back with hour two of live with Dr. Carolyn Dean along with host Ginny Gunther after this brief station break. You can also get updates and resources online by visiting drcarolyndean.com.
[music]


Second Hour - with phone-in questions and answers

[music]
00:43 Jenny: Welcome, welcome, everybody. Hour two, Live with Dr. Carolyn Dean and her special guest, Carole Baggerly, of grassrootshealth.net on the line with us this evening. So happy to have them both this evening talking about things that are important to you, which is how to have power over your own health and how to take that power back from institutions and large corporations, who may not have your best interests at heart, and to place it steadily and steadfastly in the hands of those who do, which is you. And so you are being given some tremendous tools this evening to be able to monitor your own health and your own progress using nutrients, and do that experiment of one that is so important, which is seeing how everything works for you and your body. And we've talked about so many variables in the first hour, if you're just picking us up at this point, 'cause we have people only tune in for the second hour, please go back and listen to the first hour of the show.
01:42 Jenny: The archive will be posted and, of course, included in our podcast as well, if you're subscribed to our podcast at Apple... It's on the Apple iTunes podcast-y thing, whatever that thing's called. Now, 602-666-6027 is the number to call if you wanna ask questions of Carole, although there are lots of great questions coming in from the chat line, and we'll put you on the phone with her if you would like to do that. And let me get caught up and say welcome back, ladies. Everybody happy with how the first hour went?
02:19 Dr. Carolyn Dean: Yes, A+, Jenny. It was an A+ show so far.
[chuckle]
02:25 Dr. Carole Baggerly: I very much appreciate you're asking all these questions, dear friends. It's just like I'm so delighted.
02:34 DD: Yes.
02:34 Jenny: Oh yes. Oh, you haven't seen anything yet, Carole.
[laughter]
02:39 Jenny: Okay, now let me say this. I love, love, love, and I'm so thrilled to know that our little friend, Sarah Courtney, is typing in on the chat line tonight, Carolyn. And here's something that she said. She said, "I'm so happy to see that you're collaborating with GrassrootsHealth and adding MEG testing to the Vitamin D panel. The D action study made me... "Now Carole, don't get upset. "Made me so sick in 2014, but after calling into Dr. Dean's show I learned that the 8-10 units of Vitamin D I was taking daily on the study was consuming the already low levels of magnesium in my body and causing chaos. As mad as I was, this experience brought me to where I am now, at the top of my game, using Carolyn's products. I look forward to participating in the testing again. I am not taking any D right now." So here's the side of what has happened with high dose vitamin D. But it's all working out perfectly because she's still in the loop and she's gonna be hanging out with us on this project. Isn't that cool?
03:53 CB: That's very interesting. We'll be delighted to track her test results and let her track her health outcomes with it, that's fantastic.
04:01 Jenny: Yeah, yeah, very excited, very excited. Now, here's a comment from our good friend, Lisa. This is what she says, "I'm so impressed with Dr. Dean. I even wrote to Nova Biomedical Labs to seek a partnership with my doctor and see if I could request their ionic magnesium test. After writing and calling only two times using a professional email style, unfortunately, I've been blocked from contacting them."
04:31 DD: Oh my.
[laughter]
04:35 Jenny: They don't have a consumer division, obviously.
[laughter]
04:40 Jenny: "Would you, as professionals, reach out to Nova Biomedical Labs and ask them to add ionic magnesium testing as an option to your program?" Carolyn, you wanna take that one?
04:52 DD: Well, yes. Carole is very interested in the ionized magnesium test. But as you and I know, Jenny, by being present where they do the ionized magnesium testing, it's this huge machine. I don't know if it's geared at all for blood spot testing, but we're gonna find out.
05:14 CB: It is not. [chuckle] It is not.
05:16 DD: And we found out already, it is not. So until Nova Labs sells their equipment over all over the States, right now it's still just in the research stages. When we were at the conference, the magnesium Research Conference at the NIH, March of this year, the presentations about the ionized magnesium tests, said that they're being used in the emergency room and in the intensive care. So they haven't gotten to the point where they're using it as a preventive to test the "normal population" that they say is just doing just fine with magnesium. So it's gonna take a while, but that's what our university project is about, the absorption, and comparing pure magnesium to red blood cell magnesium to ionized magnesium. And we are going to show that the ionized magnesium testing is far superior, and we're gonna force that information down the throats of the scientific community. So there, that's...
06:32 Jenny: There you go.
06:34 DD: This is an important show. Yeah, we're working on it, Lisa. We feel your pain.
06:43 Jenny: Well, it's interesting but, Lisa, you're doing the right thing because this is, again, what we're all about, is taking power over your health and asking for what you want. And Rosa Parks was just a woman who was tired and sat down on a bus, and she changed the whole world. You just don't even know what your... Seriously, you don't know what your single action is gonna do. So don't be discouraged, you're asking and the universe is always responding, and good things are gonna happen. So we're just gonna keep plugging along. And it won't be included in this panel, but we will definitely get there.
07:23 Jenny: Okay, now let's see. Where are we here? Next question, question, question. Okay, now Sharlene asks... So, Carolyn, this is a good question, alright? She says, "Are we still going to be using low-dose Vitamin D supplementation like with the Blue Ice Royal and fish oils and things like that? How do you see this going?" So Carole, I responded to the test and I get my results back and I see that my Vitamin D3 levels are not in your "optimal range." So am I then making the choice for myself that I'm going to increase the amount of Vitamin D supplementation that I'm taking in order to achieve that higher level? Is that what we're saying here, ladies?
08:21 CB: There is, at this point in time, on our website, there is a calculator that you can put in what your serum level measurement was and you can put in what you desire it to be and you can see what the incremental amount is that you might wish to take. Now, whether or not you choose to take any more to achieve a higher level depends upon you and the science and whatever. We do not have enough information... Nobody has enough information to tell you, at this point, what the appropriate balance of magnesium and vitamin D is. What we can tell you is an awful lot of research has been published, which is very definitive, that says that 40 nanograms per milliliter helps prevent pre-term birth, for those of you who're in that status of life. It definitely helps prevent breast cancer. And actually different conditions for Vitamin D, as I would expect with magnesium, need different levels, like breast cancer, to prevent that 80%, I told you about, you have to get your serum level up to 60. There is no known consequence, negative health-wise, to getting it up there. We had no toxicity, we had no other side effects that were measured to get it at that level, which is...
09:56 CB: Oh, there's one other very significant thing here. A study was done of Africans out in the wild, so to speak, they did not have skin covered and they were surveyed as to what their Vitamin D levels were in the natural world, and their levels came back to be in that 40-60 range. So from the Vitamin D standpoint, we feel that it's very safe, and in one kinda word, very natural. By the way, women who were pregnant, who were out in the wild had slightly higher Vitamin D levels. So... Oh, back again, it only takes 20 nanograms per ml to prevent rickets, alright? It only takes about 30 to do as much as you can do with Vitamin D and bone health. So different conditions really are affected by different levels, but that's why the consensus got to be 40-60, which is like... It's safe, as best we know, for anybody, and we are very eager to see with you how they interact with magnesium.
11:12 DD: Right. That's a great overview. That's important. And Carole, when you say to achieve the 40-60 with, as you're saying 4,000-5,000 units of Vitamin D, you had no toxicity, no side effects. But were you looking for the side effects that we saw when the Vitamin D craze started, the muscle cramps and heart palpitations, and migraine headaches, and arrhythmias? Were you asking about those potential interactions?
11:52 CB: We certainly asked about the migraines and the arrhythmias. We asked about pain, and to the extent that we saw the pain levels of almost every part of the body that has pain, went down as the serum level went up to about 60. What that meant they were doing with their other nutrients, Dr. Dean, I really don't know yet. But with... We did not see an increase in any heart issues or any other thing. We looked very carefully at those.
12:31 DD: Right. And so, Sharlene, what I would say is, "Are we going to still use low-dose vitamin D if the levels are low?" No. If your levels are low, and you're taking enough ReMag, I'll be recommending higher doses of vitamin D. But what I'm looking at is probably the plant-based vitamin D. And I wanted to ask Carole about those, if she thinks that they are as effective. I'm sure you know what I mean by the plant-based vitamin D...
13:15 CB: The only plant Vitamin D that I know about is... Well almost all of it has D2 as a consequence, and not D3. D3 is what your body makes from the sun. So that is always what we recommend because that's the more natural way your body has of interacting with things. D2 was used for years before D3 came about, and they saw what the consequences were. It's good... The D2, whether it's plant-based or anything else, is good up to a certain level, but then it has a hard time getting you where you need to be. And it doesn't stay in the body as long as the D3. So it's a different substance.
14:07 DD: Yeah, so I... Yeah, I know you're trying to get in here, Jenny. I'm sorry. [chuckle] I'm on a roll here, Jenny. I'm on a roll. Yes, 'cause I was looking up this Naturelo Vitamin D 2,500 units plant-based from lichen, and they say it's a Vitamin D3.
14:32 CB: Okay, that's fine. But most of the plant stuff is not D3, it is D2.
14:37 DD: Okay.
14:38 CB: So I don't think, Dr. Dean, that the quantity, though, will be different. Like if it's 2,500 from lichen of D3, it's still 2,500 iu of Vitamin D3. So wherever you get it from...
14:54 DD: Yes, yes.
14:55 CB: And if you are more comfortable with that substance, that's fine by me.
15:01 DD: Right. Awesome, Yes, Jenny, go ahead.
15:07 Jenny: What I was going to say is I went on the GrassrootsHealth and did the Vitamin D calculator, which is super fun and groovy. And I have a -38, but I thought, "Well, let me just see if I wanted to be 50." So that's in the mid range or whatever. It tells you exactly how many additional IUs you need of Vitamin D per day to reach the target based on your weight and your current serum level. So once you get involved with the thing, you get your serum level, if it's lower than the 40-60 range you go straight to the calculator, you'll be able to put in your weight and figure it out. No panicking, no worries, and you'll be right on track for what you're doing. And of course, it says... It gives you a range. Most people will be able to do this range, and the other people will need more. But we are not the need more people probably because we are saturated with magnesium. So it's very good, these little technologies that they have to offer you so that you can not have to guess or be concerned, okay?
16:23 CB: The one thing, Jenny, to attend to though is that next level needs to be tested as well, because that's what the percentages and the formula comes out to, but your body may or may not respond that way. So it's really important that after about three months the person tests again to see, "Did I make it or do I need to make further adjustments?"
16:47 DD: Yeah. Of course, yeah. Yeah, you continue the experiment.
16:51 Jenny: That's right.
16:53 DD: Continue the experiment, of course.
16:55 Jenny: Yeah, you just... That's right, you just have to end... The main thing that you would know after listening to Carolyn all these years is she is not a fan of the super high-dose craziness, and I don't think Carole is either. And we know that what we're doing is, everybody in this process is proceeding with caution and is being well informed. So we're not launching off on high-dose Vitamin D recommendations, that's not what we're doing. What we think is gonna happen, based on the fact that our people have been using Blue Ice Royal as a cod liver oil with a whole vitamin, and the As and the K2s and all the rest of the goodness in that, along with the ReMag, and living vibrant, vital, lives out in the sunshine with plenty of air, that they're gonna have great Vitamin D responses. And if they don't, there's a little modest adjustment that'll take place to, Boop, put them right over the level, and there you have it, Bob's your uncle, no problem. It's just not gonna be a problem.

Serum level not dose

18:00 CB: Jenny, if I may, I would like to suggest that everyone start making an adjustment away from dose to serum level, because the dose is extremely misleading. And we have lots of charts on that which we can share with anybody, and many of them are on our website. But for example, if somebody is taking 4,000 international units a day, the lowest reading that we saw was about 20 nanograms per milliliter, the highest was 120. That's a six-fold difference. So we have to get the body at a serum level. That's what matters to the biology of the body. And it's really, in one sense to me, it's no different than food. I eat very differently than someone else of the same height and same weight because of my biological configuration. So I think we've been misled by whomever, I don't know, actually a lot of official Vitamin D researchers even, into thinking of dose when we need to shift gears and say, "What's the serum level?" And very shortly, we just presented the results of actually five years worth of data to the FDA saying, "We really need to put in a health claim about vitamin D's effect. It needs to be at least 40 nanograms per ml in pregnant women in order to help prevent 40% to 60% of pre-term births."
19:49 CB: And what they said blew us away. It blew us away. They said, "We can't pay any attention to anything like a serum level, that's a secondary characteristic. The only thing we can make claims are is on dose." They're wrong. I mean it's flat out misleading and wrong because that's not... As I just said, It takes somewhere between 20 and say 10,000 IU a day to get to that 40, you can't do it that way. So help us all, everybody.
20:24 DD: Yeah, we're stuck in a terrible vortex there, because doctors control blood testing.
[laughter]
20:34 DD: And doctors don't know anything about nutrients. And this is why your grassroots health projects are so vital because you bring blood testing to the public with a wonderful analysis. What we've been doing up to now, Carole, is telling people to go to requestatest.com. They get their levels but they get nothing else, then they have to do their research or ask us, "Well what does this mean?" whereas you're a full-service educational project as well, as giving the number. So this is what's very important here is what we're learning from Carole about, "Yes, it's got to be what's in the blood, that's important." We know that. But about both the magnesium we... I don't know if we'll ever get to the point of having an ionized magnesium test. So that's why RBC magnesium, plus your clinical symptoms. How you feel. You're gonna be geared up by knowing you have to look at your health picture, you're geared up to work with us on this project because if your vitamin D level is low and you want to take some extra vitamin D3, you have to follow how you feel. If you start feeling a little kick-up in your magnesium deficiency symptoms, you're gonna be taking more ReMag, that's all there is to it. It's a balancing act. And it's gonna be exciting to learn if people who are low on their vitamin D, if they feel pretty good, when you get more Vitamin D, are you going to feel even better? That's what I'm interested in finding out.
22:36 CB: So many opportunities. [chuckle]
22:41 DD: Yeah, the world's our oyster. Okay, what's next Jenny?
22:47 Jenny: Okay, very good. Let's see now where are we at. Okay, and we're having... And I'm just so thrilled that everybody is excited about being part of this process and are just talking about getting involved and being able to do this, so it's very exciting. Okay, and also again, I'm just so happy that this is gonna be available in Canada for our Canadian customers. And really excited that it's gonna be available in New York State, where people in New York State and Rhode Island and some of those other states out on the East Coast cannot get an RBC test, at-request test, and so they're gonna be able to participate as well, and our Australian customers, as well. Just the international influence is just gonna be great, there's no limits to who can participate in that regard. Okay, let's see, so where are we? Phone callers, 602-666-6027 is the phone number, if you're on the line this evening. And I know we've got a lot of people listening.
23:52 Jenny: Go ahead and hit *5 on the keypad to let me know that you have a question or comment, and I can put you on the phone to talk with Carole or Dr. Dean about this research project or any other questions that you may have related to tonight's topic, again that's 602-666-6027. Now, another question that Sharlene asked earlier is... And I think you might have addressed it, Carole, but I'll ask it again. Why do people who hike and spend a lot of time outdoors
[24:25] see low Vitamin D levels? I do not use a lot of sunscreen, I spend a lot of time outside, safely all year long. I was just out on my patio getting rays in my chair today. So what do you think about people who have a high sun exposure and still low vitamin D?
24:47 CB: It depends upon lots of things. For example, one is age. I am mature in my age and I live in a low latitude, which matters, and I did a test with a meter and a whole bunch of things to see how long would I have to stay outside in those primaries from 10:00 to 2:00, on a sunny day, in order to get enough Vitamin D? And I would have to be outside in a bikini, which I don't usually wear, for at least 45 minutes each and every day. It isn't gonna happen.
25:33 CB: But I'm also at an age where my skin does not have enough of that dehydroxy cholesterol in the skin, which is what is used to convert the sun's rays into vitamin D. And so older people just in general have a harder time with that. The other thing is latitude, skin type, certainly the amount of clothing that one has on. But we've had a lot of people surprised, "But I spend so much time out in the sun." Well, what time of day, what are you wearing? What's your skin type? So forth and so on. So take a look at all those, and again look at our website, please, because there's a bunch of information there on sunshine. And how to take a look at that, but that's not terribly surprising.
26:25 Jenny: Right. And I think that's one of the things that I know about early man, was they were naked a lot. [chuckle] That's like you said, the whole industrial thing covering up. And I have read before that you have to have at least 45 minutes or an hour of pure exposure with the sun, the exposure to your whole body in order to get that level of vitamin D. So that's why... That's the value of supplementation, as we see how our bodies are being subjected to different things in our highly advanced technological world and our foods being changed, our nutritions being changed, our minerals are being changed, but yet we wanna be here and we wanna thrive, and so we have to adapt, and this is a beautiful way to be able to do it.
27:18 CB: One of the things that keeps coming up at... Certainly in vitamin D meetings and stuff like that, is taking supplements really is not an option in the majority of the world. What else can be done? And certainly sunshine is part of it, the other thing is artificial lighting, even in offices, something to acknowledge the fact that we've come in from an out-of-doors. And the other is food fortification. We already... Or we used to have some fortification of food, like milk, for example, which has the equivalent of 400 International Units a quart, and now that we have found out people are gonna need probably a minimum of 4,000-5,000 a day, you're gonna need to drink 10 quarts a day. So this is another... You've just said so many beautiful things, Jenny and Dr. Dean, it's just the citizen science, the reason we called our organization GrassrootsHealth is because it's up to me, it's up to you, and nothing, nothing gets changed, top-down, everything in this whole world has always been changed bottom-up. We're still there, we are still there, and we desperately need the citizen scientists of the world to participate in this revolution of health.
28:49 Jenny: Absolutely.
28:50 CB: [28:50] .
28:52 Jenny: No, absolutely, that's Carolyn's song, and it's been that way for the longest time. And not only do we need the citizens to participate but we need conscientious doctors to participate too, because they are exposed to the citizen in a way that they can make a difference. And so that's one of the things that Carolyn has done is to expand her outreach to the practitioner. Those who are inclined conscientiously to empower their patients as well. And we have lots of them. I mean, just great doctors like Dr. Princetta who we just love so much who's in San Diego. We have great doctors who really wanna empower their people, too. And so it's gonna happen, it's just gonna continue to happen very much so. And are great listeners as well. Okay, let's see... Questions. And we have no phone callers. People are just...
29:50 CB: One more comment... Can I make another major, major...
29:53 Jenny: Oh, you may.
29:56 CB: I am just so excited about the opportunity to expand our reach into bigger groups. One of the things that we have been looking at lately has been... There are people in Brazil, there is a doctor down there, Dr. [30:14] who treats multiple sclerosis, back again to the high doses, [chuckle] with very high doses of vitamin D, like 50,000 plus IU a day. But what he's really measuring is the PTH level, but the end result of his treatment under medical supervision is to actually cure the lesions with multiple sclerosis. There are examples of actually curing autism. And I have seen examples in the literature of magnesium being related to atrial fibrillation. There is so much opportunity out there, by paying attention not to a specific and only one condition that all of these beautiful nutrients help us with. So stay tuned for really big things, too. [chuckle]
31:23 Jenny: Now you said, In the literature, magnesium. You meant magnesium or were you... Yes, yes, of course, yeah.
31:30 CB: No, I meant magnesium, I meant magnesium. Yes.
31:34 Jenny: Right, right.
31:36 CB: And you probably know it's the biggest growing medical clinic in the US at this point in time. And you look at what services they offer: Drug A, drug B, drug C, drug D.
31:48 Jenny: Yes. Yeah, it's epidemic this whole business of atrial fibrillation, and we know that a lot of folks... The basis is magnesium deficiency, but they're told they have a heart condition, and it's very disabling. We call it medical PTSD, to be diagnosed in that way.
32:12 CB: Yeah.
32:14 DD: Yes. Very good. Oh, and if we have...
32:17 CB: Well, we would like to see...
32:19 DD: You would like to see? Go ahead Carole?
32:21 CB: We would like to see more focus with all of these nutrients and magnesium, of course, in specific projects that you and me could be involved in with all of our participants in, "What does it do for?" And certainly, breast cancer is one of them. But it's like setting up separate projects to help address those, and setting up several projects to track how well people do with AFib once they get their magnesium RBC level to something... And their D level, so forth and so on, because the scientists and the medical community aren't doing these. And that's why it is so important that we do our best with those, as well.
33:12 DD: Right. The fact that you're doing research without funding from the drug companies, there's no question that there's any influence there because so much of the current research is funded by drug companies. They'll just stop projects when it doesn't look like it's helping their cause of supporting drug research. So we have to do this research and, yes, we're very excited to be involved, and we'll take suggestions from our customers as we go along as to what they want to want us to work with. I know somebody already asked about progesterone and estrogen, but we're gonna do the basics first before going into a lot of detail. And I think you've chosen well to look at the omega-3 fatty acids, 'cause there's a lot of literature that says we need so much of that, and are we able to get it in our diet? Or do we have to take high-dose omega-3s? That I have concerns about omega-3 supplementation because a lot of it is overly processed so that it doesn't go rancid.
34:32 DD: So it's either low-processing rancid supplements or heavily processed, where the concern is that the chemicals used in the processing, that they say, "Oh, well, we've removed the chemicals." Do they truly remove all the chemicals or are there traces? So there are all these factors that I'm always concerned about. But you're doing omega-3 fatty acids, vitamin D, now magnesium, and now TSH, and the hypothyroid epidemic is so important. And what we know with our ReMyte, is that with the nine minerals that support thyroid hormone production, that we can help support people's mineral deficiency conditions that are misdiagnosed as hypothyroidism. So it's a great start. We're very excited, as Jenny said, we're helping people with that. They'll purchase the test, but we will take that amount and offer them supplements, totally discounted supplements, the ReMag, and the ReMyte, and the Blue Ice Royal throughout the study so that they can participate. And then at the end of six months, it's a second round of the blood spot testing. So do people have questions about the specific testing? I know when I did it, there were things about the finger prick, I wanted a few more needles in case you weren't getting enough blood out. We were doing a lot of spots instead of just a few spots. So can you tell people a little more exactly what they'll experience with the testing, Carole?
36:34 CB: I can certainly tell you from my own experience and whatever the finger prick, we have chosen needles that you use, and what you do is you put it on a edge of an end point of a finger after you washed it very carefully and dried it, and you press on this little lancet, and it pokes a hole in your finger. And it seems to be a surprise to people from time to time that it hurts. [chuckle] so I don't wanna pretend it doesn't, it does. It hurts, but not overwhelmingly.
37:08 DD: No.
37:09 CB: And then once they prick their finger, then if you wipe your finger with gauze... By the way, we will have a video for this for all of you who participate, to take a quick look at how it works. You wipe your finger with gauze, and then you dip your finger on this card, and you may have to prick another finger, because of the number of tests you're using, but maybe not, it really depends. Sometimes you squeeze gently on your finger, but not too hard of course. But then it's really very simple, you fill in the questionnaire, which is online, and it has quite a lot of questions that ask you to put in your... Exactly what supplements you're taking and their name and their brand and the quantity. When you took them, whether you took them with a meal or not, because that matters with a lot of supplements, by the way. So to some extent, that's the hardest thing you're going to do, to answer questions, but you only have to do that twice.
38:18 CB: And then you will get reminders in those first few months about how are various symptoms happening to you, and that's a quick and easy answer thing. But you get regular... Right now we're doing four or five day a week, very short emails, informing you about this research project, this chart, here's what's going on, it's not about you in particular, on those emails, but once you send in your blood spot cards, you indicate you've completed your questionnaire and we validate it, we get it off to the testing lab, and then a week to 10 days after we get it. You've got your results back, and you'll get an email saying, "Hey here are your results." and then you can log on to see what those results are. Everything is confidential. And Dr. Dean does not get your name with, "Here's what the test results are." That's forbidden by all of the various laws and confidentiality things. But we can post the results and show what these people do with... Who are taking magnesium, and their quantities. So it's really a very basic process, to me anyway, [39:36] . But we also have a customer service department. So any time anybody has an issue or a question about the test themselves please don't hesitate to give us a call, or what a particular reading means. Emails work great. So we're there for you.
39:58 DD: That's wonderful. Yes, Carole wanted to make sure people understood how important the questionnaire is. It's vital to be able to compare how you're doing, how you're feeling, what you're taking, with your blood levels, and to compare the questionnaire you do at the first and the questionnaire at the end. And I found it fun to do. You're just clicking, click, click, click, Advance, click, click. You're not even... You're doing it online and it's like a game. So treat it like a game, and to me, it didn't take that long. And then we're doing monthly trackers. Can you explain how the trackers will work for our listeners, Carole?
40:52 Jenny: I'll do my best. The trackers were put together specifically about magnesium. You can do personal trackers, and you can set up your own system to be... To track anything you want. Like the number of times you stub your toe a day. You can make up any tracker you want to but we have some very specific ones about magnesium and the consequences of how well you're doing with your sleep or insomnia, if you have any pain. And those you're going to be asked, you do more frequently, especially anybody that's just starting magnesium and/or changing your dose. We'd really like to see the effects very quickly on... Because magnesium, in our experience, has a tendency to act, for some conditions, very quickly. And whether or not you have migraines, just taking magnesium on one day actually influence the frequency or the intensity on the next day. So the trackers, you will actually get... You can access them any time, but you will get reminders in an email, an email will come to you with a link that says it's a reminder to update your trackers. And you click on it, you have to sign in with your ID because we can't send out an email and have anybody log onto it. When you sign in with your ID, and it takes you directly to that tracker page. And I think they're about 10 to 15 there, Dr. Dean, is that right?
42:36 DD: Right. Right. 10
[42:37] .
42:39 Jenny: Yeah. You just answer those. And many cases you just move a bar over it to say, if it's extreme, it goes one way and if it's very un-extreme, you go the other way. And then you click "Send," and again, the data on those will be analyzed and you'll be able to see charts, almost immediately, of your progress on those particular, and in this case, symptoms. You'll be able to see, "Today, it was bad, yesterday, it was worse," so forth and so on. And you can see that as well. But it's a good way to...
43:16 DD: Right, and it's monthly. We didn't go for daily or weekly.
43:20 CB: Oh, you're right, you're right.
43:21 DD: Right. And there will be a box for your comments, as Carole said, there are certain symptoms that'll be gone in a day, and people can make that note just to be on their file. And humans will look at that, it's not all computerized. So there are actually spaces for you to type in more information that will be helpful, and that you'll want to know down the line, and certainly, we will want to know as well. So Jenny, where have you been all this time?
44:00 Jenny: Okay you two chatties. Just chatting away. Okay, I'm reading the chat line, and we've got some really good practical questions, so let's do that. I just wanna respond to Garrison, and let him know once again that the sign-up page for the research program has not been set up on our website or at the GrassrootsHealth website yet, we have still been working out the particular details of how to extend you the product discounts to be equivalent of the $214 for the testing kit. So, give us another day or two. When it's ready to go, it's gonna go out through Dr. Dean's website emails, and then we will be talking about it constantly on the radio show in following weeks. And I'm sure it will be available at GrassrootsHealth. But it's not available there.
44:51 Jenny: And the other folks who've been emailing and saying, "Is this the right test? Is this the right test on their website?" No. That's not the right test. That's not the right test. $65 for a vitamin D home kit. Not the right test. What you're gonna look for when you are looking for that test is Vitamin D, magnesium, omega-3, and TSH. Those are the four tests that are involved in that. Now, somebody's asking, and a very good appropriate question, about children. Carole, can children participate in this study? And specifically, a three-year-old, a five-year-old? What's the threshold for the age of that?
45:29 CB: The threshold for the age is an authorization, not the test itself. The authorization means that the parent has to say, "Yes, it's okay for my child to do this." And that is part of the online questionnaire part, alright? And then the parent would then enter the answers to the questions on the questionnaire. To the best of our knowledge, and all of our research to date says that the serum level of children... The serum level, not the intake, but the serum level needs to be exactly what it is as with adults, somewhere in the 40 to 60 range. One of the real values of looking at pregnancy, which we have done in the past, is to see that if the mother has enough vitamin D intake, to get vitamin D in her breast milk, then the child ends up with really close to about a 40 nanogram per milliliter range. So you don't have to look at a different serum level. But the intake level, based on their weight and everything else, is gonna be much less.
46:44 CB: I wanna come back to that, though, for a very, very significant thing. If the... A preconception, alright? If the mother comes in to the doctor's office first time, and she already has a serum level of 40 nanograms per ml, she, based on all the research we've seen, will not have a child with asthma. And I don't know how big a problem in your family asthma is, but I know that if you have it, it doesn't seem to go away. But it's one of those things that totally goes away if you get the serum level up before you get pregnant because it affects so many developing organs there in that body. So I veered off of your question about children. But, yes, children can take it. Just make sure you teach your children all the time, which is like, "You're so and so. This is gonna hurt for a minute, but mommy and daddy, we're gonna hold you, and we're gonna make sure it's alright." Blah, blah, blah, blah. All that sorta stuff that we have to do with all of our loved ones.
47:50 Jenny: Very good. Excellent. Now, somebody asked...
47:53 DD: Nobody was there when I was pricking my finger.
47:56 CB: Oh I'm sorry, Carolyn.
[laughter]
48:00 Jenny: Carolyn, you would not have cared a bit. That woman is so rugged, she was probably out there dissecting frogs and doing surgical experiments on her family dog, if she even had one, by the time she was three. She was not ever worried about herself.
[laughter]
48:22 Jenny: Okay. Now, somebody's asking... Lisa wants to know, "Can you prick your ear instead of your finger? People say the ear's easier to use." Is that true? I've never thought of that.
48:35 CB: I don't know.
48:35 Jenny: How would you direct your blood coming out of your ear with that little card? It seems like that would be awkward.
48:43 DD: That's where you'd have to have your mother beside you.
48:45 CB: You have to have a friend around, that's for sure.
48:48 DD: Yeah.
48:48 CB: That's for sure.
48:49 Jenny: Yeah.
48:49 DD: But yeah, on earlobes that... It's got a lot of blood circulating. That's a very interesting idea.
48:56 CB: It does. It does. It does.
48:58 Jenny: Okay, Lisa, let us know how that goes. Just make sure you get the little blood spots in the little hole where you're supposed to. It would be awkward but interesting. And then again, so just to get to Carole's point, and we're going to have to keep to... Keep saying this over, and over, I think, to ourselves, is during the testing, since the dose of D3 in Blue Ice Royal is unknown, how will we calculate the amount of D3 we're taking? But what you're saying, Carole, is we're not looking at the dose, we're looking at the serum level. And so we really just wanna find out what is the serum level as a starting point, is that right?
49:41 CB: Almost.
49:42 Jenny: Okay.
49:42 CB: That is the determinant of your health. On the other hand, on the questionnaire we do ask "What is the dose?" or "How much vitamin D are you taking?" Or for example, all we really ask for is, "Tell us the name of the product and how much of that product you are taking," like you've mentioned a product, and... I'm sorry, which one is it, Jenny, that they are taking, which has vitamin D in it?
50:14 Jenny: The Blue Ice Royal which is the vitamin D, A, and K2.
50:19 DD: Okay. In that, you are required to list on the product label itself how much vitamin D it has in it. And so what we ask for the participant to say is, "How much of this Blue Ice are you taking?" And I don't know if it's in teaspoons or gallons or whatever, but they enter what the unit have met like, "I'm taking half a teaspoon a day." That's fine, we calculate what the equivalent amount of D is, what magnesium is, whatever else is there. So how's that?
50:53 Jenny: Okay. That sounds wonderful. Alright. So our very good...
50:56 DD: Let me interject, that it is very tricky with Blue Ice Royal because it's a batch to batch of fermented cod livers, and they don't give us the value... The amount of the vitamin D. They do not. So that's what makes this testing very important for us is, "Are we recommending enough?
51:25 CB: Then we all basically need to talk with you a little bit more on what the details are of that particular product, but we can work with that.
51:33 DD: Sure, yeah.
51:34 Jenny: Okay, very good. I just wanna be clear, too, for our Canadian customers, because I know they'll wanna participate with tremendous joy. So Lorraine, our distributor in Canada, is not carrying these kits in her place right now. I think it's cost prohibitive for her to have to carry the kit and then distribute all the coupons and discounts and things 'cause of the way her situation is set up up there. But you get the kit in the United States, it will be shipped to you in Canada, you will send the blood spot testing, you'll register, you'll send it back in the mail as quickly as possible after you've completed your questionnaire, and your results will be reported directly to you. We do not get any of your results. That is confidential. You're not gonna get it from Lorraine, you're not gonna get it from us. This is now... Once you enroll yourself in a research project you're on your own with the research project. We're gonna support you, but your information is confidential and it works directly with the research project. So I wanna make sure you guys are super clear about that.
52:47 Jenny: Okay. The other thing I just want to do real quick is, we have two callers holding with only five minutes left. So I know we wanna wrap up. I'm going to ask our callers to send their questions to support, support at rnareset.com, and we'll answer your questions on next week's show and/or through the email as well, so we don't wanna leave any stone unturned. And the other question, very important question is, "Do they stop taking their supplements, while they're doing this?"
53:25 DD: Well, of course...
53:26 Jenny: No. No.
53:27 Jenny: Okay. [chuckle]
53:29 CB: No.
53:30 Jenny: Okay. Yeah. So the point is not to find out how your body functions and what your results are when you're not supplementing. The point is to monitor your supplementation progress and make sure that you're getting the outcomes that you want, which is to have the proper amount of thyroid hormone, the minerals that you need to support the magnesium that supports your insomnia. This is what we're proving with this research project, is the efficacy of supplementation, and that you're on the right track.
54:02 DD: Right. And what we decided was we were gonna tell our customers to do their test first thing in the morning, before they take their supplement, and do that as their standard way of testing. I think that will... That's what we do with the magnesium RBC, as it is. It's just the overnight fasting. So don't take a supplement and then do your blood spot immediately after. So no supplements in the morning, do the morning test, and then send it right off in the mail.
54:42 Jenny: Okay.
54:44 CB: One highlight here with... Not with that in particular, but we have had the assumption made that a lot of people think that, "I've got my vitamin D or my magnesium level or whatever where it needs to be, 'Gosh, I'm glad that's over.'" And people do not realize that they need to keep taking these supplements essentially the rest of their lives because their body needs them. What they do need to do though, is periodically test. And specifically with vitamin D, the best time to test absolutely is right now, because you're just hitting the fall period... And if you had to establish a permanent time, you're just hitting fall and your vitamin D level, almost no matter where you are in the North American continent, is gonna be at its highest.
55:40 CB: On the other hand, always take a test early spring, after winter, because it will be at its lowest. And that will always give you a good measure of, "Okay, now what do I do? I'm 10 years older. Who knows what... " but plan to keep paying attention to this for the rest of your lovely lives.
56:03 DD: Very good. Good timing to start the project. Very good.
56:07 CB: It is. It's perfect. Perfect.
56:13 DD: Jenny, closing remarks?
56:15 Jenny: Okay. Excellent. Well, I think everybody has been richly edified by this whole presentation. I know that so many of you are excited about doing it, and we are, too. Carolyn and I got our little kits, and we whipped those little buggers out, and we sent them off and got our own results, and are enrolled in the project as well. And it's just exciting. And we're just so grateful to every single one of our customers, who is such a partner with us on this journey. And you know we stay with you and we thank you for staying with us on all the wonderful things that we're desiring to accomplish. And I do thank Dr. Carolyn Dean, who is an extraordinary fearless leader, for her leadership in this whole realm of magnesium supplementation, and public health advocacy, and individual advocacy. And the same for our very good and very new friend, Carole. And I'm sure, Carole, you'll come back. The... Maybe the mid-point, maybe the beginning of the year, and we'll have an update and we'll chitty-chat and see what we came up with, and what all the fun things that people are doing, and the experiences they're having as a result of participating. Do you agree?
57:28 CB: Of course. Any time.
57:31 Jenny: Yeah. Very good. Very good.
57:33 CB: Maybe not so many times, but I'll...
57:36 Jenny: Very good. Yeah.
57:36 DD: Yeah.
57:37 Jenny: Thank you everybody.
57:38 DD: It could be before the six months. We're gonna be getting reports. Maybe in three months we'll have an overview. But, yes, once again, thank you so much, Carole. Big hugs and kisses. Thank you, Jenny. Thank you, Bob, who did not interact, but he is a...
[laughter]
58:01 DD: He's been here all along.
58:03 Jenny: Bob, we love Bob. Yay, Bob. That's Carolyn's [58:05] Carole. Thank you.
58:09 Bob: Yeah. I didn't understand one word. I didn't know what the heck you guys were talking about, that's so minute.
[laughter]
58:15 Bob: Where is the generalist? I need a generalist.
[laughter]
58:19 DD: Thank you, Bob, thank you, Jenny.
58:19 CB: Thank you, all of you.
58:24 Bob: Thank you.
58:25 DD: Goodnight.
58:26 Jenny: Goodnight everybody.
[music]
58:31 S5: You've been listening to Live with Dr. Carolyn Dean, here on achieveradio.com. Until next time, so long, and thanks for all the fish.
59:22 S6: Achieveradio.com.
[music]


Some GRH Kit tests- Nov 2019

GrassrootHealth lets people be informed about their body by getting test information
They have 14 different test kits
Vitamin D (with all projects)
Omega 3 (very common, with almost all projects)
Inflammation Panel (D, Omega 3, CRP, HbA1c)
Magnesium (Red Blood Cell)
Even more information is supplied by testing more things
$283 Vitamin D, Magnesium, Omega 3 Index & TSH PLUS Elements Test Kit
$214 Vitamin D, Magnesium, Omega 3 Index & TSH Test Kit


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